Secure property rights are FUNDAMENTAL to personal freedom and democracy.

People of Christchurch!

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.”   Thomas Jefferson

Welcome to my blog,

I believe I have found the reason why such incredible powers have been used in the so called “rebuild” of Christchurch. My reasoning is based on what is found on the Christchurch City Council’s website and the associated documents which are used or refered to by the council.

Please follow the links I provide, which will, step by step, reveal what the people we elected are up to.

There is no doubt the explanation for the actions of our government is outrageous, but the things you will read are more than mere coincidence.

Lets review some of the more obvious things that have happened. If you are a citizen of Christchurch, you will know all these things anyway.

Red zoning in the suburbs.

We have seen whole suburbs “red Zoned” which means that these will be compulsorily taken over by the government (with negotiation with insurance companies) and at 2008 valuations.

Stop Press. This is an update about events that are happening as I write.

First of all a number of these red zoners have applied for a Judicial Review of the above mentioned Red Zone process.  The government for some reason has linked the taking of the red zone land with whether the owners are insured or not. This has left over 200 red zoners who find the government offer unsatisfactory because

1. Their property though uninsured, is either undamaged or quite repairable.

2. The government has offered them 50% of the land value only. This means they will get less than 20% of the original value of the property

3. Their property is not damaged or only slightly, so why should they have to move out at all?

The learned judge stated, among other things,

1. The government acted outside its powers in creating and enforcing the red zone.

2. The property owners  be properly compensated using legal means.

3. Made a declaration that the decision to create the red zone announced on 23 June 2011 did not lawfully affect the property rights of the property owner applicants in the proceeding CIV-2013-409-000843 (the ‘Outcasts’).

Here is the judgement.

http://thedemiseofchristchurch.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/judgement-on-20130826-fowler-developments-ltd-v-ce-cera-and-quake-outcasts-v-min-for-cer-and-o.pdf

Of course the government has appealed and this appeal is happening about now.

Watch this space!!

Because the Christchurch City Council and the central government, has raised the standard of building required, (ranging from a minimum seismic proof foundation, double glazing and even the distance from the oven to the opposite bench etc), it is therefore impossible to actually replace your house with the insurance and purchase payouts anyway (if one’s payout ever comes).

It seems from some reports that an average retired couple with no hope of raising a further mortgage, may be several hundred thousand dollars short of replacing their previous lifestyle. But regardless of whether the house is still liveable, the occupants must move out.

Some “Red Zones” include entirely undamaged houses where the red zoning is justified by there being a “Rock Fall hazard”, in spite of the fact that in many cases no actual rocks have fallen on or nearby during any of the earthquakes. The citizens therefore appear to be being locked out of their houses for no discernable reason.

In other red zone suburbs, the reason is given is that the council will be unable to provide services to that area. However the citizens still must leave, and the opportunity of any attempt for these citizens to organise their own utilities has never been on the agenda.

The same excuse has been used in limiting new housing developments where some developers feel that installing blue water waste systems for new houses is a perfectly acceptable and “environmentally friendly” solution. This would remove the burden on the council which admittedly is stretched in supplying reticulation to western suburbs and would hasten the supply of much needed buildable land. Unfortunately this is not acceptable by the bureaucracy.

Please note that these red zones generally follow the river boundaries and although the damage in many areas is devastating, they most certainly  include  a significant number of undamaged and/or repairable properties.

Not moving is not an option – if you elect to stay in a red zoned property utilities will be cut off and your property will be effectively confiscated anyway.

http://cera.govt.nz/faq/residential-red-zone-purchase-offer/the-offer-0

Well the above link has been changed, although if you are interested it does serve to enable one to look around the correct government web area.

Fortunately I copied the information so I can give you a link from my own library. This booklet can still be found at the above site but you will need to search for it.

In particular look at Page 10 “What will happen to my property if I decide that  I do not want to accept the Crown’s offer”

Purchase offer supporting information for Residential Red Zone (March 2013) – residential-red-zone-purchase-offer-supporting-information-booklet-20130327

Further Info

ccdu_govt_nz_faq_land-acquisition

Red zoning in the CBD

A list of facts.

Demolition of buildings behind a cordon with little or no consultation with the building owners and their tenants with no chance to recover business and personal property (Although some cases were documented where the demolition people stripped the building and on sold everything of value).

“Red stickering” of buildings meaning no one– including the owner could enter with no provision for the owners to recover property. Only after contracted protest after weeks and months later were essential business files and plant able to be recovered.

The building owners and tenants were  therefore prohibited from guarding their property. Therefore apart from the inevitable theft, there was consequential and preventable damage from weather, flooding and after shocks.

The creation of an impenetrateable bureaucracy where for instance, a demolition plan was demanded from the building owner within a short period of time, but even if that plan was presented, the bureaucracy carried out the demolition anyway, not only trying to contract the liability of any accidental damages to life and other property to the buildings owner, but also charging a “management fee”.

The bureaucracy acted so slowly in any case that most small business owners went out of business, not only because they could not even recover the cash from their till (which was typically consequently rifled by persons unknown) but their customers were locked outside the zone as well. The time between the earthquake and the recovery of essential business property bankrupted these businesses and as tenancies therefore lapsed, after more than two years, the building owners are facing financial ruin as well. Especially as enough time has now passed for typical business interruption insurances to have run their course. Yet even accepting that all the streets were too dangerous for the public (which they weren’t), it would have been simple for the bureaucracy, once all life and limb was accounted for, to actively assist these businesses instead of locking them out AND thereby helping restore the associated employment and jobs these businesses bring to the city.

Another branch of the bureaucracy has been given the responsibility to “manage” the Christchurch “rebuild” but through the conferred monopoly (all repair work must go through this agent), has leveraged the price of builders labour to such a low level that many builders simply cannot find work. And the “agent” takes a commission on all repair/building activities.

The central and local government does not pressure insurance companies to make timely payouts. As a consequence, few private rebuilds are occurring. Many payouts are estimated as being years away.

Compulsory purchase imposed after property prices had fallen sufficiently.http://ccdu.govt.nz/faq/land-acquisition

Government intends to resell property back to the private sector after plan is implemented. In any other context this would be construed as speculation by the government using private property and tax payers money!

detroit-then-now

 

In fact, from the very first earthquake, the authorities (Mainly the CCC) appeared to be deliberately allowing businesses to die

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10714099

This is strange because any reasonable person can see that in a disaster, after the initial immediate safety of everyone has been attended to, business are the next thing which must be preserved. Simply put: If a job is lost we have a family of refugees and dependants. If  jobs are preserved, we have a population who can look after themselves, attend to their housing and other disaster needs without too much if any official help

Why completely demolish our old city including perfectly good and functional privately owned properties in order to build a different new city?

This is the sort of thing we criticize third world countries about. It doesn’t happen in good old “democratic and free” New Zealand does it?

 

Finally we have imposed on us a “Plan” for the new Christchurch CBD which bears no resemblance to the Christchurch we all know and love.

Here it is.

http://ccdu.govt.nz/sites/ccdu.govt.nz/files/documents/christchurch-central-recovery-plan.pdf

 Not only that but there are a good number of ultra expensive items whose cost will need to be met by the rate payers of Christchurch, the tax payers of New Zealand and our children and grand children.

The Canterbury earthquakes have provided an unprecedented opportunity to rethink, revitalise and renew central Christchurch”   Christchurch Central Recovery Plan. P 3.

Actually we are not witnessing a “rebuilding” of Christchurch –

We are witnessing the building of a new city where the city of Christchurch once stood

- created at our expense.

Make no mistake! We and future generations are being mortgaged to pay for all this.

“Unprecedented opportunity”? For whom?

 Are the CCC and the government crazy or have they at least lost the plot?

There is no doubt that this authoritarian approach has slowed the recovery from the earth quakes. Government energy directed to making sure insurance companies are meeting their obligations in a full and timely manner would definitely be better than the bureaucracy we have now!

But Gerry Brownlee, His Worship and others are not the clowns they appear to be,

there is another agenda which is at work here.

Take a read of this link from the Christchurch City Council website!

http://resources.ccc.govt.nz/files/SustainabilityPolicy-docs.pdf

Here is an excerpt:

 

Christchurch City Council Sustainability Policy

1. Introduction

Sustainability is a word that is used often, yet means different things to different people. This Sustainability Policy seeks to clarify what the City Council means by the term sustainability. This will enable Council policies and strategies to adopt a consistent point of reference for the term and for the related concepts and principles to be incorporated with more consistency into Council activities and decision making.

2. Policy Aim

The Sustainability Policy is one of the high-level Policy Frameworks that have been designed to help guideCouncil activity.

This Policy aims to embed sustainability into our Council and community. To help make sustainability “the way we do things around here”.”

At the heart of a democratic society is the responsibility for community leaders to make decisions on behalf of, and in the best interests of, present and future generations.”

(Well I think they have got that one wrong, Aren’t community leaders supposed to serve the community, not make decisions for the community? Isn’t that the difference between democracy and totalitarianism?)

 

To be sustainable, Council recognises that our society must be Efficient, Cyclic, Solar, Safe and Social.” Solar = “Renewable powered and carbon neutral society”

The extraction or harvest, processing, distribution, use and reuse of goods and services is powered from renewable sources and our society is carbon neutral (emissions are first reduced, then offset).”

There it is in black and white. The Christchurch City Council is committed to making Christchurch a “Carbon Neutral” city!

This is the “unprecedented opportunity” given to the Christchurch City Council and the Global Warming proponents in government by our disasterous earthquakes!

Not only are they persuing  an unadvertised/hidden agenda but they are also taking advantage of cantabrians many of whom are facing their darkest days and years.

Oh and please note the use of this phrase: “

Scientific uncertainty is not used as an excuse for preventing harm.”

Well that gives them a fairly blank card to do what they like dosn’t it?

Except for the mention of carbon, this policy is actually a summary of Agenda 21,  a product of the UN Conference on Environment and Development (UNCED) held in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, in 1992. Global Warming caused by Carbon Dioxide emissions (thats the meaning of “emissions” in the councils policy) was not invented in 1992.

Read this carefully -

In this policy, the Christchurch City Council does not mean financially sustainable, they mean that they are going to make sure that Christchurch is going to be in the forefront to do its part in saving the planet from “carbon dioxide poisoning” or “Anthropogenic Global Warming”.

If you are not familiar with the Anthropogenic Global Warming theory, a highly biased account can be read at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_warming, This Wikipedia account is biased because it treats the theory as fact when in reality there is no actual empirical proof and neither is there any truth to the claim that there is “scientific consensus”. (if you want to read a realistic commentary on the subject try http://www.rogerfromnewzealand.wordpress.com)

Some may think the council’s efforts to “save” the planet is a good thing, some may be ignorant on the subject, others see carbon dioxide induced global warming as the biggest crock in history.

But no matter what you believe, and regardless whether Anthropogenic Global Warming is real or not, the theory through Council and Government policies I have shown is affecting us right now. 

In our pockets because

WE and our children and future generations are paying for this in taxes and rates

and

in our life style and opportunities because

Christchurch is our city and it is being changed into another city.

Their agenda is not to restore Christchurch into the vibrant city it once was that we all knew and loved but to create this futile Carbon dioxide neutral city !

I say futile because even if the  theory of carbon dioxide heating the earth was fact, New  Zealand produces only 0.11% of the world industrial carbon dioxide. Therefore if New Zealand was removed from the earth, global warming would not be significantly affected in any way.

 The Christchurch City Council aided and abetted by our government sees the Christchurch earthquakes as an “unprecedented opportunity” to make Christchurch into the worlds first absolutely Agenda21 complying Carbon Neutral Eco City.

This link no longer exists. The UN seems to change its website frequently

http://www.un.org/esa/dsd/agenda21/

However this link gives us similar information.

http://www.un.org/jsummit/html/basic_info/agenda21.html

If you wish to view the original script, here it is

http://thedemiseofchristchurch.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/agenda21-script.pdf

Like all UN documents, at first read it looks reasonable, however on closer examination one begins to realise all the doors it opens. There are also a host of ancillary papers etc. published by the UN and its subsidiaries which detail particular objectives in more detail.

Agenda 21 of which NZ is a signatory, states among other things that governments should “Transfer land”  and make laws to protect river margins, make cities sustainable and pollution free and move populations into these cities so cars are unnecessary and suburbs can be returned to their natural state. Populations should be crammed into small eco compartments in the cities and even population control is mentioned.

Did you know that Christchurch City is a member of Local Governments For Sustainability?

http://www.iclei.org/

Clause7Attachment[1]  Check clause 5.7

which is the way Agenda21 is implemented through the back door by advising and funding local “initiatives”.

It is not a coincidence that the Christchurch Recovery Plan ticks all the boxes for a Agenda 21 complying city.

The United Nations Agenda 21 and other agreements have already entered our legislation!

Check out this page from the NZ Ministry of Environment website!

www_mfe_govt_nz_laws_meas

Here is a typical link which describes the effect of Agenda 21 and ICLIE on their city.

Watch the videos and search for other opinions.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/what-is-agenda-21-after-watching-this-you-may-not-want-to-know/

United Nation documents are designed to look reasonable. It is only after careful interpretation and examples of implementation that one gains an idea of the insidiousness of the organisation.

No wonder the CBD of Christchurch is being compulsorily “purchased”.

Were you consulted when by the Christchurch City Council or government about any of these things?  Definitely not, but we and our children are the ones who are and will be paying for it.

Worst of all, our democracy and freedom is in more danger than we realise.

The UNITED NATIONS is not the government of New Zealand!

Lets keep it that way.

Lets be careful who we elect into Government and Local office.

At election time grill each candidate about Agenda 21 and ICLEI.

What ever your political leaning, lets keep New Zealand sovereign and democratic.

.

Finally,

This blog is intended to promote discussion on the future of Christchurch.

If you have a fact or something that should be included here, please comment and I will most likely include it.

If you think some of the things in here are not fact, I would like to hear from you too.

If you think Bob Parker’s “Eco City” is a  good idea and you are ready to help pay for it – please  comment and tell us all why.

If you have a relevant article send me the link and I will include it here.

Finally, let me quote Pericles from 430 BC:- ” Just because you do not take an interest in politics it does not mean that politics will not take an interest in you.”

Our only way out of all this is to make sure we are all informed about the issues of today, We as a nation need to not blindly vote at elections but need to understand these issues and vote according to the policies. Be very dubious about election bribes, because a policy that offers to create or support something can only be done using your tax money. Make sure that policy spends your/our money wisely.

I will be updating this blog regularly, we have barely scraped the subject here.

Finally another quote.  George Bernard Shaw:

A government which robs Peter (Those working and paying taxes) in order to pay Paul( those for one reason or other do not work) can always depend on the support of Paul.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10746069

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10751443

http://http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10734370

Oh and if you have any actual doubt about all these asertions and still do not believe that we are being taken for a terrible financial and undemocratic slide over  a few United Nations agreements and a shonky Anthropogenic Climate Change Theory :- try reading the Christhurch Central Recovery Plan which I mentioned above but you didnt bother to stop and read

http://ccdu.govt.nz/sites/ccdu.govt.nz/files/documents/christchurch-central-recovery-plan.pdf

and check page 41: or click on the book mark “Ideas to reality” and read the following.

“SUSTAINABILITY

Over the long term, greater Christchurch has a unique opportunity to redevelop the city so that it is resilient to environmental, social and economic changes that may affect future generations.

Greater Christchurch can expect more droughts and floods and a rising sea level due to the changing climate. Energy costs will increase the demand for efficient energy and transport systems.

New technologies and competition for global resources and talent will reshape the way business is done.

More sustainable technologies and approaches can be part of the redevelopment of central Christchurch. It is possible to address the environmental impact of construction activities, building design and performance during the planning stages. This approach is more effective than retrofitting.” etc etc

You might ask a councellor where the measures are to guard against “floods and a rising sea level due to the changing climate.”  seeing as how Christchurch especially the CBD  is barely above the high tide mark.

Would also be educational to ask a councellor approximately how much are sea levels expected to rise should the ARCTIC ice melt completely.

If you know the answer to that, please comment. I know the answer down to the last millimetre so I can correct you if you get it wrong.

Congrats to the Greens, your policies are now enshrined in our legislation and we have a government who is prepared to trample over our property rights to carry them out.

Shame on you Greens for pretending to protest about this in Christchurch on Dec 10 2011. You must have been chuckling up your sleeves all the way to Cramner Square. No wonder you tried to shout down the Act Party representative!

STOP PRESS:

Check out this article in the Christchurch Press.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/city-centre/9113552/20-000-people-for-city-centre

Consistent with Agenda 21, our government is getting ready to concentrate citizens within the Christchurch CBD.  Did I mention that above on 29/11/12?  Yup just a few paragraphs read above and there you will see it. No I am not a soothsayer, the progression is quite clear when you study Agenda 21 a little.

Next we wait for population control and restrictions on farming. Goodby democratic NZ!

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15 Responses to Secure property rights are FUNDAMENTAL to personal freedom and democracy.

  1. rogerthesurf says:

    I may have inadvertently locked people out of commenting. I think I have changed that setting now. Please feel free to comment.

    Regards

    Roger

  2. enochered says:

    Climate Change, Global Warming, call it what you like, it is a pack of lies. It is a power grab. The North Pole has been growing while they tell you it is shrinking. The extent of sea ice in 2011 was the most extensive ever recorded, the last record year was 2010. The sea level is not rising it is falling because there is more ice not less. They show us photographs of lumps of Greenland ice falling into the sea as an example of Global Warming when it is in fact global cooling. Glaciers creep, when they have crept to the edge of the ice shelf they fall off. If it was warming the glaciers would be receding. I think if you check out your politicians you will find that they are either Paedophiles or Jew-ish one will be blackmailing the other to conform to the UN which is jew-ish controlled. We are all in deep dooh-dooh. You will find it hard to make people wake up. Good Luck and welcome aboard.

    • rogerthesurf says:

      Enochred,
      Thanks for your comment, much appreciated, but whilst you are commenting on my site please do not lay any blame on racial groups.

      It is true that there are evil players about but this is nothing to do with their ethnic background. Besides the UN is a Green/Communist controlled organisation which probably includes all racial types of one sort or another.

      On another tack, your talk about the glaciers is interesting. Have you ever considered how much the melting Arctic ice will contribute sea level rise?

      Cheers

      Roger

      • enochered says:

        I made a decision some time back, to talk about Jew-ish people, which I had thought, until you corrected me, to be a religion, in the same way as those Jew-people talk about Muslims, which is also a religion I believe, without any problem from people like you. Jews have in fact demonised Muslims and are conducting a “War on Terror” against them, for something which was carried out by Israel. I’m deeply sorry if that upsets you. As for the North Pole Ice Cap it is bigger and more extensive than it has ever been. We are in fact heading for a mini Ice-Age. Sea levels, despite what we are being told by those whom compiled Agenda 21, are falling because there is in fact more water trapped in the extra snow and ice. I guess this is good-bye Roger.

      • rogerthesurf says:

        enochred,

        The question about the Arctic sea ice was just a probe to see if you were aware the Archimede’s principle applies here. Floating ice, melted or unmelted, can have no effect on the sea level whatsoever. Just a little fact to know when people tell you that melting of the Arctic ice (which is mainly floating) is going to inundate coastal cities. Indeed the Otago Daily Times here published such a series of articles a few years back.
        As for the Greenland Ice Cap, (which is not floating), the IPCC admits that a complete melt of this would take at least 2,000 years. Will find the reference for you if you are interested.

        Cheers

        Roger

  3. LibertyGrace says:

    Yes Communism and Fascism are kissing and flirting with each other as both work to destroy the West. With our Marxist fraud of a president and clueless vice president, the United States is in serious trouble but many are starting to wake up. Many of our police departments are becoming militarized and Homeland Security is a growing nightmare but some of us are starting to push back. Aloha.

  4. Hi Roger, thanks for the message on my blog. Sounds like we have some similar views on Ceras and the governments performance in CHCH, I have a feeling that I am becoming paranoid but there has been a pattern in their disaster management here. It has stripped land rights from many of the poorer people/eats side and small businesses. The deliberateness of their actions is distasteful. I am not sure yet if your agenda 21 is a valid theory or not, they may be just totally incompetent! thanks Nicky arts@cardmakers.co.nz

    • rogerthesurf says:

      Hi Nicky, I wish it was simply incompetence and there is a fair measure of that as well. However it is interesting how the events in Chch are falling beautifully in line with Agenda 21. Why don’t you go to the CCCC’s website (http://www.ccc.govt.govt.nz) and do a search for the words ‘agenda 21′ and ICLEI and see how long our local government has been working on this.(give yourself some time because there is plenty of reading there. The earthquakes were an unprecedented opportunity alright – a great opportunity to build a new city to comply with United Nations orders when we were all down and land was cheap.
      Even though you may support the global warming theory, at the very least it is important that we should be explicitly informed at to what and where our tax money is to be spent on and why our businesses were destroyed and our land taken.
      As for the latter, I sat through the Judicial Review and I heard how the government exceeded its powers with regard to moving people out of the suburban red zone. So convenient that Agenda 21 is hot on clearing river banks to protect the waterways and restoring wetlands (aka swamps).
      Unfortunately it is making sense. I even predicted that the government would move people into the CBD and what did I read recently? http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/city-centre/9113552/20-000-people-for-city-centre and so it goes on.
      Agenda 21 is hot on emptying suburbs because it not only enables land to be returned to its ‘natural’ state but it is more efficient to concentrate cities in order to decrease co2 emissions. So bear in mind that your business and others like it are considered unsustainable and therefore of no consequence. How people are to be otherwise gainfully employed has not been revealed.

      Its quite possible you agree with all this and are proud to make your contribution, but as an economist I think the future for us is dire. Not from AGW but from this foolish faceless bureaucracy.

      Hope you can find time to read all this.

      Cheers Roger

  5. bobsid36 says:

    Hi Roger,
    I must have been asleep or something but I have just become aware of Agenda 21 in the last month. However I have been aware for a lot of years that there are dark forces out there that are trying to manipulate and control society. I come from Scotland where we question authorities and appear to be more switch on to what is actually going on in the world. Kiwi I have found are really passive and slightly detached from what is going on elsewhere. It seems to take something landing on the door step for a reaction here. The earthquake and subsequent debacle of governmental, insurance issues and local authorities mismanagement are the things that have landed on the door step. I knew when the earthquake happened that these issues would arise. So I was not alarmed at the government and local authorities imposing there rights to compulsory buy land and I then resell it, presumable at profit to the private sector.
    I love Christchurch and that why I moved here from Scotland. Sure it has its issue but what city doesn’t. I am already despairing at what has been build in Christchurch since the earthquakes. These great concrete prefabs that go up in weeks. Horrible cube with no soul and sore on the eye. The Cathedral fiasco it also something else that has disgusted me. I mean this is CHRISTCHURCH and they are now going to demolish this lovely building. The cathedral is Christchurch signature building. Every tourist comes to see it and to be at the heart of the city, it was iconic. I’ve seen the proposals and the rezoning maps. I’ve also heard about the private business men who are buying or already own parts of the city centre and there vision for it. So these few individual are going to decide what the city is going to look like without any public consultation. Somethings not right there. All that land in the east side just snatch away from the people and left to rot at the moment. It’s like living in two cities at the moment. Here out west is looking pretty good lots of rebuild new subdivisions popping up. looks good. Go out east, it’s like a third world country. Its desperate and my heart goes out to the folks there. The roads are akin to roller coasters and I even broken my car on them. No concession for road user either. Sumner is a disgrace to, with those containers and those poor buildings still hanging of the cliffs there. Give me a break its been 3 coming on 4 years and they are still there. Yeah it’s shabby and disgraceful. All the politicians of every party should be hanging their heads in disgrace. I mean no-one is advocating for these private citizen. Its all money in their pockets if you ask me.
    Another thing is why are there any unemployed people in this country when we have a city to rebuild. Why are the government not setting up training apprenticeships to skill a work force for the rebuild. They could be learning whilst they build their own homes Wouldn’t that be a great investment by government and would give people a better life and produce a society with greater spending power to rejuvenate the economy as well.
    Well we know why and its Agenda 21. I’ve read and watched a fair few you tube videos about it the last few days and it is evil. I also attempted to read the actual document that was published by the UN but its very long winded and a disheartening read that I couldn’t read on but will try to.

    I guess one of the saddest things for me is that generally people are so apathetic and seem not to care and can’t be bothered to even inform themselves. In general it’s only a very minority of people who do care and we are like voices in the wilderness. I mean I put you page onto Facebook for folks to read. I got one reply from a friend warning me not to read conspiracy webpages. He doesn’t do conspiracy website. He couldn’t be convinced to even bother to read the stuff. This is what we are dealing with. Its like the frog being boiled and its going to be to late when they’re on the plate.
    It was like a few years ago at the general election before National got in, I asked folks who they were voting for and nearly everyone said National. I asked them why? reply, just because it time for a change. I asked if they knew any of Nationals policies? they couldn’t tell me a single one. I spoke to my french pal here afterward and he hit it on the the head by saying they got what they asked for, now they have to live with it and no point crying about it now. There is none so blind as them who do not want to see.
    Hey I leave you with this, there’s more than just Agenda 21 people should be worried about. There are all sorts of things going on that are going to impact us all soon.
    I’m not sure if you believe the bible but a lot of whats happening today is prophesied in there. I am a Christian and I don’t vote. Why because all political party are corrupt and are only out to seek there own gain. They have no real concern for the people they are suppose to be serving. Some politician enter politics for noble reason but they are few and far between. Another reason being that Jesus is my King. All these things are going to happen no matter how loud we scream but Jesus also promised he was coming back. Thats when all these corrupt governments will tremble and fall. If people could see through to message of God and His love for them then this world would not be in such a mess. Of course the gospel is another hugely important message that no-ones got time for these days either, which is un-measurabily more terrifying and regrettable than any thing Agenda 21 has to offer.

    Regards

    Andrew

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  7. Bryce Wilkinson says:

    Hopefully the following primer on property rights is helpful in this context.

    http://nzinitiative.org.nz/shop/Library+by+type/A+Primer+on+Property+Rights+Takings+and+Compensation.html

    • rogerthesurf says:

      Bryce,
      Thanks for your comment.
      I read your link and found it a great analysis of what property rights actually are.
      Just wish Gerry Brownlee was so well informed when he created the suburban red zone in Christchurch, which you may not be aware, includes undamaged properties and properties with negligible damage. Of these, some were uninsured, and through Mr Brownlee’s order, (it appears there was no parliamentary debate for his action), these people, who are quite prepared to underwrite their own risks, will lose practically everything through Mr Brownlee’s non consideration of their property rights.
      You mentioned that property values are set by the public or participants in the market, but you did not mention the refusal of insurers to protect red zone properties and other perceived ‘risky’ properties which has also forced valuations to near zero. You mentioned that governments can alter property values by their policies:- this has happened and is happening, with negligible chance of recompense, not only in the suburban red zone of Christchurch, where all utilities are being progressively cut off as I write, but in the CBD red zone where once again, owners of perfectly serviceable undamaged or repaired buildings are being forced to submit to the government’s ‘purchasing’ program – along with every other owner whose properties lie in the path of our government’s Agenda 21 complying ‘sustainable’ CBD earthquake ‘recovery’ plan.
      All the bad things, which you warn about in your essay, are happening here.
      I hope your organisation will take the chance to study and analyse what is going on here as soon as possible.

      Cheers

      Roger

      • Bryce Wilkinson says:

        Absolutely Roger. In case you or others are interested in joining in the battle, this 2001 publication contains my best effort to diagnose the deep source of the problem and propose a remedy – in the form of a Regulatory Responsibility Act, modelled on the Fiscal Responsibility Act: http://nzinitiative.org.nz/shop/Library+by+type/Constraining+Government+Regulation.html

        In 2009, the Regulatory Responsibility Taskforce proposed a much more authoritative and professionally-researched proposal: http://www.treasury.govt.nz/economy/regulation/rrb/taskforcereport. Its proposal has superseded the 2001 proposal, although its proposed remedy (a toothless slap on the parliamentary hand from the courts) is VERY weak. This did not stop a few critics from claiming that its remedy would bring NZ Inc to its knees.

        In terms of parliamentary action, Gordon Copeland’s bill to put protection for property rights into the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act failed to get enough support in the House, as did Rodney Hide’s and Sir Roger Douglas’s bills based on the Taskforce’s proposals. The current state of play is that the National-ACT 2011 confidence and supply agreement at http://www.parliament.nz/resource/0000178710 provided in point 2, for limited progress to be made in the form of a Regulatory Standards Bill. There is intense public sector, political, and academic opposition to providing effective remedies for people whose property rights are being trampled on. Until public opinion changes, most people funded by taxpayers, which includes, parliamentarians, the public service and academics are likely to favour a continuation of the unprincipled status quo. One political party in parliament is an honourable exception, but its hold is tenuous, given public opinion.

        Bryce

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